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Category: Ephesians 5:21, 22

Are complementarians power freaks?

Are complementarians power freaks?

Are complementarians power freaks? On Women in Ministry blog by Cheryl Schatz

Are complementarians power freaks? Complementarians are people who believe God created men to be in authority over women. Tom has written very strong criticism about me saying that I believe all complementaries are power freaks. I am answering publicly through a post because I believe it may be helpful to some to see both sides and answers to comments are not easily found. Seeing the accusation and my answer allows the reader the opportunity to determine which facts hold up to the test of truth. To see the previous parts of this discussion see below:

Part 1 is here. Part 2 is here. Here is the third part of Tom’s criticism.

Tom’s criticism


I think you should carefully consider what I said. Because the attitude displayed toward those who have faithfully translated the Scriptures was so harsh, so stereotyping, and so based in an ignorance of the facts at hand, that it is not at all unwarranted to suggest bigotry. Perhaps you are so convinced of your point of view that you do not see the unloving attitude you and others posting on this blog have toward those who sincerely take the Scripture at face value in this area. Like many of the issues which divide the Church, it is those who insist on adding to the plain statements of Scripture who are the source and continuance of division. That is what Catholicism is–additions to the Word. That is what Calvinism is–additions to the Scripture. That is what Pentecostalism is–additions to Scripture. The list includes all the denominations. You boil it down, they almost all have some areas where they are sticking the Word of God as-is, but at least some area they insist on adding to it. Your version of God’s teaching on women is the same. You have to add to, interpret, appeal to “cultural matters”, get into the “intent of the human author” etc, etc, etc. Rather than the plain statements of Scriptures. Such as, “As the Church is subject unto Christ, so let the wives be to their own husbands in everything”; and “I suffer not a woman to teach nor to usurp authority over the man, but to be in silence”; and “Let your women learn in silence with all subjection…and if they will ask anything, let them ask their husbands at home”. Etc.

For someone to take these at face value should not be greeted with the–yes, bigoted–reaction I find here. You really need to take a heart check. Can you not see that the motives of someone who has been redeemed by the blood of the Lamb, and who has given himself totally to God, forsaking all, to have a bad motive for simply wanting to believe and practice the Scripture as-is? THAT is what some of the writers on this blog need to consider, and why I really think you should consider your heart attitude–because you are so confident you know the heart motive of a whole class of people. And THAT IS the definition of bigotry. I mean, think about it: what makes for racial bigotry? Its when one racial group views all others of another racial group in a negative way, without knowing them. You know, statements that reveal bigotry a such as: “all whites are greedy”, “all Japanese are bloodthirsty”, “the only good Indian is a dead Indian”, “all blacks are lazy”, etc. So what is the difference between these kinds of statements and “anyone who believes woman should be subject to man in the family and in the Church is just a power freak?” Which is the attitude you portray.

I love God. I am just a miserable sinner saved by grace. My life is not my own. His Word is to be obeyed. If he had said, “Men shall submit to women in the Church and not teach”, I would delight in doing that for my Lord. If He had said, “it is a shame for a man to pray uncovered”, I would delight in wearing a covering for my Lord, delight in displaying my obedience to him, unashamed, for all to see. Had He said, “Husbands, submit to your wives in everything”, I would joy that I can serve the One who shed his blood for me and bought me, by dedicating my life to obeying my King by submitting to my husband. If He said to be silent in the meetings of the Church, and I knew the daughters of Philip prophesied, I would be open to the Holy Spirit using me anywhere He would that He has not specifically told me I must not, and I would be confident His power will be all the more displayed as I walk in love and obedience! As a man, I follow my Lord’s command, running my home according to His word, teaching according to His Word. Please examine your heart. You do not know the motives of the people you are talking about, I am confident of that. And I KNOW that your analysis of me as one of those is not true. And I KNOW that you have spoken in ignorance of at least one specific point (the manuscript evidence for “submit” in that verse of Ephesians 5). Something is amiss. Be you a true sister in Christ: grace, mercy and peace be with you, from God our Father, and the Lord Jesus Christ our Savior. Tom

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Submitting to one another defined

Submitting to one another defined

Submitting to one another defined - Women in Ministry blog by Cheryl Schatz

Am I a bigot? Apparently one of my readers thinks so. This is my answer to the second part of Tom’s criticism from. My first response to Tom is here. Tom suggested that I was a bigot because of my views on submission in Ephesians 5. In this article, I will define Christian “submitting one to another” which is far different than obedience and gender or class subordination.

Submitting to one another – first the criticism

Below is another portion of Tom’s criticism to me and my answer will follow.

Third the “submitting one to another” is defined by the rest of the passage, and the rest of the New Testament. Please remember that parents/children and masters/servants are included in this passage. In these relationships we also find authority/obedience. The “mutual submission” works according to the various relationships God has ordained. Parents “submit” to their children’s needs by raising them in the nurture and admonition of the Lord. Children submit to the parents by obedience. Servants “submit” to their masters by offering them not only an outward obedience, but also obedience that is from the heart. And 1 Peter shows us that the submission to authority is especially important when the authority is “froward”, harsh, or unreasonable– “NKJ 1 Peter 2:18 Servants, be submissive to your masters with all fear, not only to the good and gentle, but also to the harsh. 19 For this is commendable, if because of conscience toward God one endures grief, suffering wrongfully. 20 For what credit is it if, when you are beaten for your faults, you take it patiently? But when you do good and suffer, if you take it patiently, this is commendable before God. 21 For to this you were called, because Christ also suffered for us, leaving us an example, that you should follow His steps:” Not a very American concept, but there it is–it is suffering patiently under unjust authority that really brings reward. We Americans are so lusting after having no authority! Yet, look where reward in the Kingdom comes–from patient suffering under unjust authority! Perhaps we should consider the Scripture, “and others were tortured, not accepting deliverance, that they might obtain a better resurrection”, and again, “if we suffer, we shall also reign with him”.

Thus, to return to Eph 5, the “mutual submission” applies to both the authoritative and submissive roles of the various relationship. Now, as to the remark about letting the words of Paul be over those of Jesus–this demonstrates unbelief in the Scriptures, for it is written in 1 Corinthians 14: “If any man think himself to be a prophet or spiritual, let him acknowledge that the things I write are the commandments of the Lord”. Paul got none of his teachings from men, as we are taught in Galatians–he got it straight from Jesus. In Thessalonians, it is written, “if any man obey not our word in this epistle, note that man, and have no company with him”. When you read the Epistles, you ARE reading Jesus’ words!

When it comes to the teaching of submission and the Lord Jesus, please note that the one thing Jesus learned was obedience, as it says in Hebrews. Note also that Jesus was subject to his earthly parents: NKJ Luke 2:51 “Then He went down with them and came to Nazareth, and was subject to them”. This was part of perfectly fulfilling the Law of Moses. But the command is repeated in Eph 5, “Children, obey your parents in the Lord”. So Jesus showed perfect obedience to his head, the Father, as well as to the man and woman who were his earthly parents. The Church is obedient to Christ, and so (as Ephesians so plainly says) ought the wives be to their husbands. Again, I strongly urge you to do a heart check in your attitude toward men (and women) who stand for what the Scriptures say about the authority of males in the family and in the Church. (From Tom)

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Answering criticism of bigotry on Ephesians 5:22

Answering criticism of bigotry on Ephesians 5:22

Bigotry of women in ministry? Women in Ministry Blog by Cheryl Schatz

Is it bigotry? Answering a critic

Is it bigotry to suggest that the term “submit” in Ephesians 5:22 is not in the original text and that translators who imported it into the text may be misled to believe that Christian submission is one-sided? Apparently, one of my readers has recorded his criticism saying that my view borders on bigotry. I set the challenge aside to craft a response when I had time to research a complete answer. I failed to answer in a timely fashion, and another project and ill health put this research on the back shelf. It is now time to provide the evidence for the missing verb in Ephesians 5:22. This post responds to the first part of the criticism that I copied below. I hope that my readers will find the discussion helpful.

First of all, your scholarship is shallow and you are showing a very judgmental attitude toward the translators. It borders on bigotry, I suggest you check your heart before the Lord.

FYI the verse 22 DOES have the word “submit” (upotasso) in it. Only two manuscripts–P46 and B have upotasso left out. “Submit (upotasso) IS in thousands of manuscripts, including Aleph, A, D, F, G, I, K, P, Psi, the Uncials, the Byzantine; ancient translations into Italic, Syriac, Georgian, and Slavic; and ancient quotations by Chysostom, Origen, Basil, Theodore, Ambrosiaster, Ambrose, Jerome, Pelagius, and Augustine (not to mention Ignatius, in the Epistle to the Philadelphians, chap IV). Why did the editors of the NA27 Greek text leave it out? If there’s a bias in this issue, it would seem to be one that wishes to avoid the submission of women to men as taught in this verse. The only major translation that seems to follow the NA27 at this point is the New American Standard. All the others–and rightfully so, given the manuscript evidence–follow vast majority of the manuscripts, and the critical editions such as the Majority Text, Stephanus, Scrivener, and render the verse, “wives, to your own husbands submit, as to the Lord”. (Submitted by Tom)

Why did the editors of the NA27 Greek text leave out the Greek word for “submit”?

Tom suggests that the bias is with the NA27 team. Did they want to avoid the issue of the submission of wives? Tom seems to suggest that at best the scholars who produced the Greek text of NA27 had no good reason to leave out “submit” in Ephesians 5:22 or at worst that they were themselves biased. I set out to look objectively at the evidence. I found several compelling reasons for the omission of the verb “submit”. I also found out that the NA27 is not the only Greek text that has the term omitted in Ephesians 5:22. The Lexham Syntactic Greek New Testament: SBL Edition (Society for Biblical Literature), the UBS 4th edition and the NA28 all leave out the verb in verse 22. There are also countless scholars and commentaries that note that the earliest manuscripts do not have the verb in verse 22. So, let’s have a careful look at the evidence.

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Ephesians 5:21, 22 and Christian liberty

Ephesians 5:21, 22 and Christian liberty

Christian Freedom on Women in Ministry blog by Cheryl Schatz

This post is the essence of the sermon Spirit-Filled Living part 1 by Pastor Darrell Johnson of First Baptist Church, Vancouver, BC, Canada.  If you would like to listen to the entire sermon, you can listen to the sermon here.

Spirit-Filled Living Part 1

The revolutionary and alternate understanding of human relationships in Ephesians 5 & 6 are contrary to deeply engrained patterns of behavior. Even after 2,000 years, the Church has yet to work out the implications.

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